That will never work, because then we'd have to have barricks for the men, barricks for the women, barricks for the gays, barricks for the lesbians, and barricks for the bisexual. Because you know that a straight man will never sleep with a gay man. That is why we have two barricks now, so that the men can't sleep with the women, so we can't allow the gays to sleep with men, or it would be discrimination. See, it just causes all kinds of problems.....once you make an exception to the rule, you have to allow more exceptions.

It will take some time to get accustomed to, but the true benefit in the end is that NO ONE who is willing and able to serve in the military will be excluded from being permitted to take the same pride in their country as any straight man or woman. It's not an exception to the rule, it is establishing a "no exception" rule: you serve your country because YOU choose to, and who you are and who you love have no bearing on that.

Katherine, the Army already excludes hundreds of thousands of people that want to join, just because they had asthma. Plus, they won't let you join if you dropped out of high school. Or, if you have too many tatoos, or if you have too many kids, or .... Gays are just one more "OR" that they won't allow. They have their reasons for all these "exclusions", reasons that they learned over the past 200+ years, and they stick to them. I'm glad they do, look at the great Army they have created, and look how they have protected you and me. Keep up the GREAT work!!!!

The only reason that this is being considered is because we are short on service personel. I quote from Chairman Shalikashvili, "Our military has been stretched thin by our deployments in the Middle East, and we must welcome the service of any American who is willing and able to do the job." If you are gay, and dont have flat feet, asthima or too many tatoo's, then becuase we are spread thin, gays are now being considered for military service. Need brings acceptance. We need Servicemen. We accept all Americans who are able. Being gay does not make you unable. And sleeping in the same room as a gay person does not make you gay, but it may make you uncomfortable. Such are the sacrifices for our GREAT Country.

I would hate to serve with a gay man...I am with Mike, no dice from me. I am a Catholic and don't want to have to serve with gays.

I will have to agree with Mike and Brandon on this one.. it would open up more boring sexual harrasment briefs. Who wants to stand next to a soldier standing at the position of Parade Pretty? Not me! The Army has already lost enough Military Bearing, do we want to lose even more? JMO

I think thats it's only fair for the gays to be in the militery cause if it's okay for men with families(a wife and childern) to go and fight and have the chance to die it also should be for gays. It shouldn't matter who goes and fights for us. If they want to we shouldnt stop them from doing it just becasue they like that same sex.

Brandon and PV2, you are not with me on this. I think you mean Mark. I think that the need of service personal makes the it possible for homosexuals to be accepted by military standards. I think that if we want to keep the Army growing you may need to accept those that are not usually accepted. The Sacrifice that our service men are going to have to make is actually accepting these men and women, at least in a way that they can work together. I'm sorry Brandon that you would hate to serve with a gay man, but if the Army wants to grow that is what you are going to have to do. It's just like in the Private Sector... except that you get to chose who you shower in the morning.

If we allow Homosexuals to join the ranks we will have to admit that being gay is a status or a natural state which one can legally exist in. Their joining the military would also discourage unit cohesion. nevertheless, once these brave soldiers returned home they would desire to reassimilate in civilian life. With the army's blessing they could be hired to fill jobs that would otherwise be filled by good God-fearing men and women. One should also note that in the past military service has often made society view those that served as equals (African-American Service in WWII) this would further degrade American society, possibly to the point of their being allowed to marry. Besides all of the exceptions and other accomodations that would have to be made. I think that a world in which Goebbels "Final solution" had been carried out on these people (Those that refused to recant) would be a better world.

God-Fearing New-Yorker you are a bigot I don't know how you can function in our world. And you call yourself a Christian.

I think you sound like Hitler NewYorker.

Gays are and have already served for decades people, without all the hassle! Are many of you too stupid to realize that? Come on, it's the year 2007; give it a rest!

I think the army should enlist all the gay people in america, train them up to satifactory condition, deploy them to every frontline mission in every hostile situation throughout the middle east and other parts of the world where there is conflict.If they feel that they are being discriminated upon by the army taking such actions, a token guesture of our appreciation would be to give them all a box of chocolates and a pink teddy bear to make them all feel a little sassy whilst in the heat of battle, can you imagine, it would be a new revolution amongst the ranks, gayism wins the war.....WAKE UP.

Fuck the gays, and lesbians, their just a bunch of people that got tired of the other sex and started to go to the other. If gays/lesbians are allowed to join the army, then we are totally fucked and desperate

Mark, you make it seem as if thats something wrong this gays i mean they're humans just like you and me so you cant judge them because of that i see it as if a gay person wants to join the army let them, there's no shame in that i mean you cant just throw away someones dream because of a belief that you were brough up wit i mean me personaly i think thats garbage of the army and for that reason i dont think i wana join..i mean why hate if your a straight man and you dont want a gay person to hit on you i mean be a man n let them know.

bloodnose, i believe you should just die slow because if they let you join the army then they just totally fkd and desperate...i mean why do da U.S gota be full of so many haters its 2007 i mean grow up just face it i mean it makes yall seem like the smaller person because there are more important things to be worrying about and yall got yall mines on the little things....no life

Brandon, yu a ass kisser i c you run with what everyone else says i mean just amit it dude your gay but afraid to say it...gyve it up i mean the only reason why people have problems with gays is because they hear other people tawk about hatin it so they do the same n GOD might have said what he said about gays but remember he also said "Thou shall not hate" so think about that one before you try to bring down a gay person...n alot of ppl klaim they dun agree with it kuz of the bible...gz half yall dun even read the bible

If you all would just pay attention and put your differences aside, they are already in the military. You can't stop homosexuals from joining, you can only stop the process of not asking someone. Look around in your units and I can almost guarantee that you have atleast one homosexual in your unit. I know I do. Do they bother you now? Probably not so just leave it alone. There is no way that congress will pass it but they are still in the mililtary and they will continue to join. They have the right to fight just like you and I. No, I wouldn't be thrilled with the fact of sharing a room with a gay person but we are in the 21st century and gays are not going anywhere.

The military is an inherently and necessarily a discriminatory service. We cannot accept those with Asthma, the obese, those with totally flat feet. These are not willy-nilly or bigoted discriminators. They are based on necessity and proven problems enherent with these individuals. It says nothing about these people other then they are not suitable for Military service. The ban on openly homosexual people is the same. There are too many enherent problems, both phyical and emothional (unit moral being only one) to allow an openly and practicing homosexual to serve. THe degree of emotionalism in the responses to this post is my case in point. However, if an individual is homosexual and desires to serve their country then they can repress their sexual desire and serve away. The current policy allows for this. I do not understand GEN Shalikashvili's statement and find it a bit disengeneous given his position while on active duty. Shortage of Service members should never be used to compromise on standards.

Please, Please don't let the gays join the army this would only create more problems within. Americans would be embarressed if gays were in our military. This would only say that it's o.k. to be gay and don't try to fool yourself into thinking that it is cause as you know in the end deep down inside you it's wrong. Yes, I know, I know the truth hurts sometimes.

i believe they shouldn't allow gays to enlist. mainly because i feel that the military is the only one left in this country that tries to keep all the morals we've been raised knowing and keeping everything that's good in this world. I am baptist and strongly believe that by allowing gays into the army, or any armed forces would be like breaking the last stick before all is lost to the ways of sin. Seriously we must keep our military straight, and with good morals as we've been raised.

eyes wide open, to your comment, with your statement respecfully taken, i'd just like to add it's possible that they dont' bother anyone (those who are in already) because they know the consequence of being caught in a situation like that. so they'd prefer to keep it quiet and not bother anyone with it. Least that's what i would do if i was in that position, if there's something wrong and there's a consequence to it, you obviously wouldn't show it or let people know. NOW, if it was legal, and ok to have gays in the armed forces it's possible since there's nothing against it. Gays might act a different way now, since what they do wouldn't get them introuble since it'd be legal now. Least that's what i think.

Trutalk this one's to you man. I do read teh bible yes the bible states not to hate. But what gays are doing is a sin. and teh bible doe say to look down upon sin. and it's only right for a christian to try to not spread a sin. SO by us trying to keep openly gays out of the armed services, were doing our duty as a christian and trying to keep from from sin. Again the bible says not to hate. but that's against some one with out a reason or something. The bible says "thou shall not kill" but were all soldiers and when in war it's ok because your doing your duty as a christian and defending your country, doing your job, and keep Our Faith alive. What's sad though is i'm only 16 and can contradict you guys. please put worthy statements if you plan to truly defend something.
Respectfully,
Brandon

Gays should even be allowed in this fucking country much less our army. The Us army has kicked ass over the past 200 hundred years without the help on any homos and just because our army is a little spread out right now doesnt mean we need to go out and get a bunch of fucking homos to serve all this mean is we need more men to step up and serve our country.

Personally I think anybody that wants to serve should be allowed to do so. Regardless of one's physical capabilities, sexual preference, beliefs, etc. I think it is wrong that somebody tells me what I can and cannot do for this country supposedly built on freedom. I think it is wrong that upon my death I cannot be honored with the traditional ceremony given our servicemen and women because somebody tells me I cannot join. I think it is wrong that American’s are so bored with life that they must create problems that are none of there business. But oh well it’s the wonderful country we live in right? Oh incase anyone reads this I am not gay. I am actually a person with a disability, but it is pretty much on the same level.

I'm sure there are gays already serving in the military. "Don't ask, Don't tell, remember! I am mad as hell that people with asthma can't join. I think it is a very stupid rule. I mean asthma sufferers do take medicine to control it. So why shouldn't they be able to join.

I don't think open gays should be allowed into the military because there would just be too many problems like mark said. . . one thing that I think is stupid is the Asthma thing, yes, I have it, yet I do have it under control to the point that I havent had an attack for the last year! I think it is unfair that pple with asthma cannot serve their country just because of a little respitory problem. . .

Just a little F.Y.I. for all of you sniveling little pricks. I served in the United States Army, proudly, and was an open homosexual. I was in a combat MOS serving in "tight quarters" many times, and didn't once feel the need to jump the other soldier that was in the foxhole with me at that time. Not every gay or lesbian serving in the U.S. Army wants to jump every person of the same sex that they see everyday nor do we care what the other man/woman has to offer up while taking a shower with them. Current views are just as ignorant now and they were years ago. People have graduated from being sissified queens or dikes, and are now very intelligent, hard working citizens who deserve every right that straight or "Normal" people have. These people today are very professional, hard-working men and women who wish to put their lives on the line to serve their country and should be afforded that right.

Are we not smart enough to do the job? Are we not strong enough, whether it be physically or emotionally? Bullshit! I served side by side with men in combat who knew I was openly gay and did not once in my career give a damn about their looks or what they had in their pants. My job was clear, the protection of our borders and its citizens. The protection of the United States of America. Everyone, not just the "Straight" or normal, but everyone within these great United States. There are many other issues that need to be dealt with other than gays in the military and they have been around for years, but no one seems to care. Gangs, Biggots, Adulterers, Racist, and hippocrits. These are major issues that need to be tackled, and believe you me, all that EO training was a bunch of crap. As soon as you would leave these trainings you could hear soldiers laughing and making fun and what was just heard and for some, giving them new nick names, jokes or fire power against someone outside of their race. For years the Army has sat idley by and let many things happen, and for years, gays have served this nation and gave their lives to protect it. Why now, why all the hoopla about gays in the military. Is is OK to allow them to serve now just because our recruitment numbers are down and we need to fill the voids? Is is OK to say, we'll let you in until the war is over then you have to go? No, it's not. But guess what, we are already here, and have been for many years.

There have been a great many gays that have served in very high ranking positions, both Enlisted and Officer wise, and no one was any the wiser. I had the privilege of serving with many highly decorated officers and enlisted soldiers who were very popular and held some very important positions with the DoD. No one knew - these were people who commanded thousands of troops, and even people who only led a few, but their name sakes would shock many of you if you ever found out. Field and General Officers who have been put into the history books over the last ten to fifteen years. How and what are you going to handle that if their names were ever given out. Are you going to reprint all the historic books and memoirs of these great leaders. No, I don't think so! But think of the shame you would have, knowing that some of the most popular people to have ever commanded troops in "Your" Army were gay. Oh My God. We serve among you now and have served among you in the past, and will continue to serve among you in the future. It is time that you put your ignorance of your parents and grand parents behind you and take a good look around the world and realize that there are many gay and lesbian CEO's, COO's, Presidents and Vice-President of huge corporations, CFO's, Generals, CSM's, SGT's, LT's and CPT's standing before you today serving as your superior and we do not care which side you swing on, and it should not matter to you which side we swing on, but that we made it to that position somehow, and I'm sure, especially in military, that it wasn't by sleeping our way to the top. I know that I didn't sleep with any Generals, CSM's, DoD Members, Joint Chiefs, or even the President himself, to get to where I was. I did by being the best soldier that I could be and having discipline, and morals.

Ignorance is no longer an excuse. Get educated about gays in the military. As much as you "Straight" people may hate us, we may very well be your superior, and there isn't a damn thing that you can do about it but deal with it, or quit. And what is more sad than anything, is that most of you "Straight" people, never have a problem with a superior or even a subordinate, until you find out they are gay. What a crock and shame on you. You liked me when you thought I was straight, and your superior, but now that you know that I'm gay, I'm not good enough anymore. Shame....on all of you. I wouldn't give up one moment of my service to this great nation, nor would I ever consider returning any of the many awards and citations that I received during my tenure in the Army. I worked very hard to achieve each and every one of them, saw lots of foreign soil, did things that would turn most soldiers stomachs, all in the name of protecting our borders and our people. So if it was OK then, then why isn't OK now? Now that someone found out that I was a homosexual. Does that make me any more less of a great leader? I hope all of you wake up, grow up, and educate yourself on the volatile issues facing the world today. We are standing beside you with an M-16; We are standing behind you with an M-40 or M-60; We are standing in the front of your formations as your leaders teaching you survival during combat situations and how to get your happy asses back home when you go on a deployment. Wake up! Smell the coffee! We have been here for many years and we're not going anywhere. Go 7th Group - Lead the Way.

Col. Craig..I agree with you. My daughter was gay and they harassed her til she killed herself. Now they are keeping all her journals and documents from me and denying that they have them. How can I fight the Army? How can I retrieve documents I know they have? I loved my daughter and she was my only child. Her sexual preference didi not make me ove her any less. She was a combat medic in the Army and wanted to help people. The Army destroyed her! Now I am left with an emptiness and extreme anger towards those who repeatedly mistreated her. Her roommate also reported her extreme stress and suicidal thoughts but were ridiculed for it. Her leave was repeatedly denied. She was coming home finally just 30 days before this happened. They kept on harassing her and threatening her until she finally shot herself in the head. These same people denied they knew anything about her emotional state. I am so angry.

To all of those so opposed to gays in military and army, say that to the people I know who serve right now. Its really not a big deal and usually isn't a big deal with the other soldiers either. Its all of you that do the damn fussing.

The USA and ARMY just needs to get over it. gays and lesbians are not going anywhere. everyday i see more and more everywhere i go people need to suck it up and treat them human! as you want to be treated it doesnt make any sense to me why the world can be so cruel and im a straight male! so wtf i dont mind it. as long as they dont come on to us whats the problem.

i love everybodys body overthere

Col. Craig, thank you for your service to our country-- and for the well-written message you have posted on this board. Everyone needs to read it and be enlightened by your opinion. The ignorance that pervades some people is very sad. Thank you!

Devastated Mother, I am truly sorry to hear about your daughter. She must have been brave to decide to join despite the inevitable discrimination. I am not so brave. I had been thinking of joining the military for sometime now...and I am strong enough, fit enough, smart enough, willing to fight for my country...yet I won't do it because I know I would likely end up as she did. I will wait for the day when something changes... so anyone willing and able will be allowed to serve the U.S.A.
Thank you to your daughter for her willingness to join the military despite the prevailing ignorance.

by the way-- all of you bible believers-- if you have ever had sex for the purpose of anything other than reproduction, you too are engaging in "SIN" and should be looked down upon...

people like you are why I strongly dislike Christianity...do you ever stop to really think about what you are saying? Someone has brainwashed you to get to the point where you would say things like "god-fearing NYer" has ... everything you say, and everything you believe in, is not the way of the world-- somewhere someone propogated that load of crap that you have posted in this discussion--it had to start somewhere--so who is to decide whether it is RIGHT or wrong?

Remember, sex for pleasure is a sin, if you're such a strong believer in traditionalism and "God-fearing" religion.

Wow, I am glad after reading the responses to this subject that my family was not as ignorant as some of the individuals. I was thinking about signing up for the army, however, after seeing the blattent stupidity of some of the respondants the Army is not showing the Best that America has to offer. Glad there are other branchs of Armed services to concider

I think that gays should be allowed to join. I think all they want is to serve their country, have their lifestyles recognized on the same level as everyone else's and just be themselves and not having to worry about being discriminated by what bubble they choose on an application. People against gays make them sound like a bunch of diseased people that will try to turn others gay. Just because a gay guy is put to work with a straight guy, doesn't mean he's going to try to do anything. Think about it, does every straight man go around trying to get every woman? or does every straight woman go around trying to hit on every man? No, similarly gays aren't just walking around constantly thinking of who they can get. They're just people living their lives like everyone else. Likewise, we're all different, some people are poor, some rich, some with red hair, some with blue eyes, some with one parent, some with pets, some like men, some like women and the list goes on but we all adapt and live our lives. Furthermore, despite the people that are against them, gays still try to enlist to protect a country they love and its civilians even though some of those civilians hate them. I think the people that are going to despise someone thats willing to die in battle for the security of people sitting in comfort within their homes is doing more of a wrong than homosexuality can ever be considered. In the same way that race, color of hair, shoe size, or eye color has no affect on what we believe, sexual orientation doesn't either therefore the only thing that matters is the willingness to enlist and serve our country.

Gay people do not deserve nor have the right to serve in the United States militarty, we need the most well rounded and strong handled people we can find. Not homosexuals whose only thoughts are i wonder wht.....it finishes itself but the military should not lift the gay ban because we would be looked as being a weak country or gay oriented country. It does say IN GOD WE TRUST on money...lets make this world the way god wants it, all people are equal and should have an opposite sex mate.FUCKIN GAYS